Talk:Countersteering

You push in the direction you want to turn. The "counter" part refers to the fact that you are actually turning the handlebar in the opposite direction when you do that, so that is probably what is was intended to say by that change that was made. I remember from the Motorcycle Safety Foundation course that pushing in the direction you want to turn makes it more intuitive and therefore easier to remember. I have corrected the article back to my original and merged counter-steering into this article.Spalding 04:13, Dec 8, 2004 (UTC)

I don't think the cleanup tag is justified - between my explanation and the external link, I think it is clearly and logically explained. Spalding 17:10, Feb 4, 2005 (UTC)

The following text from User:Manning Bartlett has been copied from the counter-steering article to merge it into this article:

I sat down with all good intentions of writing this article. But as soon as I began to research the various web-pages, I quickly realised that I was out of my depth physics wise.

So here are some links that may benefit a proper physics person to explain this baffling phenomenon. The pages all seem to disagree with each other as to what causes it.

[1] [2] [3]

steering geometry

I have looked at the three articles of the three links above. All three of them are in perfect agreement, but the third article discusses the physics in much greater depth.

To expand the wikipedia article, the dynamic behavior of the steering geometry would have to be discussed. The forefork designs of bicycles are little miracles of engineering: if the proportions are just right the steering geometry makes for a forgiving balance behavior of the bike, and it enables smooth steering. By contrast, a bicycle with a vertical steering column would be an absolute nightmare to steer.

Actually, experiment proves otherwise. See The Naïve Bike easily capable of being ridden AndrewDressel 00:01, 19 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

To some motorcyclists it may appear as if their front wheel reads their mind, steering in the direction they want to go. Generally motorcyclists feel that they are thinking themselves through a curve.

A bike is steered by shifting its balance; the front wheel follows these shifts.

Direct experimentation by California Superbike School suggests the opposite. AndrewDressel 03:20, 19 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The balance is manipulated with well-timed, minute turns of the front wheel. --Cleon Teunissen | Talk 20:31, 10 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Contradiction

Anyone notice that paragraph two, about gyroscopic effects, appears to be contradicted by the rest of the article?

"Motorcycles turn corners using the gyroscopic roll reaction force of the spinning front wheel."

vs

"If a biker wants to turn to the right, he first throws the bike off balance by a well-timed jolt to the handlebars, momentarily pointing the front wheel slightly to the left. The center of mass of the bike plus rider will continue in a straight line, but the contact patches of the tires move to the left with respect to this straight line."

So, is it one, the other, or both? AndrewDressel 03:28, 19 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Not to mention that precession rate is inversely proportional to spin rate. That means that if "gyroscopic roll reaction" is really the mechanism, it happens twice as slow at 60mph as it does at 30mph. That doesn't sound desirable. Does anyone have a reference to someone who has done the math? AndrewDressel 13:10, 19 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]