Discussion for plans of a possible reorganization of the "Communism" series of pages. The purpose of such is to streamline the existing pages into a set of more clear, concise articles with single points, rather than several entries which cover eachothers points, but in different ways.

Structure

The top portion of this page should deal with the reconstruction of the various Communism pages.

Outline

Outline an idea for a future set of pages. This is speculation for now; let's not change any existing articles until we come to some agreement.

My (Oceanhahn) plan is to simply rewrite the Communism and Communist states pages into three distinct subjects:

Communist History, which deals with the real effects of communist states, death toll (for the purposes of avoiding an ongoing dispute, I propose that numbers should only be expressed through rough numbers -- eg: "tens of millions", "several thousand"...) and all. Will take the place of the Communist states page, or perhaps a new article can be written from scratch. As a point of interest, the Communist states page seems more to do with "Communist Politics" at the moment; perhaps the history page could be expanded to include this. Discuss.

Communist Ideology, the various syles of communist theory -- Marx, Stalin, Castro / Guevara and all. A new article to replace / encompass what has already been said on the old Communism page. (I probably should not have put discussion for reformatting on a page with this name...)

Communism, a breif article on the subject which covers both of the above in as few words as possible. This will take the place of the existing Communism page, and will hopefully function as a portal to other articles as was suggested in a Talk:Communism discussion.

Catalog of Existing Pages

So far there are a more than a few existing pages on the subject of communism (not counting socialism, which is a whole new can of worms)... To keep from repeating ourselves and taking up unnecessary space, we should try and group up as many sites as we can. If you dont know how a site fits with either Historical Data or Communist Theory, then add it to the bottom of the Other Pages list.

Major Pages

Large pages or pages to be reformatted go here.

Communism; The page where all this began. Currently intended as an ideology page free of historical or political data but rich with the theory of communism. According to designs in Talk:Communism, this could become a good portal to other, more specific pages. Whether is stays that way is up to chance. Cited for reformatting.

Communist states; This is somewhat baffling as it would SEEM to be a good candidate for all the history and politics of communism -- death counts, accomplishments, references to the Soviet Union, et al... -- but it seems to simply be a mess of NPOV infractions combined with a brief history of communist states, communist theory, communism and politics, and economics. I would like this to be a page for the sucessful and failed cases of communist states. Cited for reformatting.

Lesser Pages

Stubs and specific flavors of communism go here. These will likely end up as links.

Theory Links -- Kinds of government ideologies

Marxism; Looks pretty good as-is, but worth looking at, if you haven't already. I haven't looked at all the links here. Some may be relevant. I don't know, and it really isnt all that important at the moment.

Trotskyism

Leninism

Stalinism

Libertarian communism

Juche

Historical Links -- Various communist nations, their governments, their track records, and their leaders.

Soviet Union

Peoples' Republic of China

Cuba

Vietnam

Laos

North Korea

Yugoslavia

Albania

Vladimir Lenin, Leon Trotsky, Josef Stalin, Nikita Khruschev, Leonid Breznev, Mikhail Gorbachev

Fidel Castro, Che Guevara

Pol Pot

Mao Zedong

Marshal Tito

Other Pages

Miscelaneous links to be decided upon last.

October Revolution

Anti-Communism

Notes

Any short design changes or considerations should be noted here. Please keep them breif, or list it in the TALK section.

If you have added something to the STRUCTURE section, and have left a comment which relates to another of your comments, then please include your username by using three tildes (~~~).

Talk

I've used the top of this page to categorize a new set up for multiple Wikipedia pages to hopefully someday replace or unify the current tangled mess of communist entries. If you have any good ideas, I'm they'd probably come in handy since we're trying to help everyone out here. Thanks! -- Oceanhahn 09:51, 13 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Thoughts and Opinions

Before I go and get too involved in this, I'd like to hear what other people think. Agree? Disapprove? Comments? Please post them below. --Oceanhahn 22:12, 13 Sep 2004 (UTC)

I wholeheartedly agree with your plans, especially since I was the first to suggest such a move. Thank you for setting it in motion. My opinion is that most of what is in the Communism page could be transferred to this page, and expanded as needed. --McCorrection 00:24, 14 Sep 2004 (UTC)